Retro Duo Portable - RDP 2 in 1 Portable System

[kedawa]

It's a real shame that all these clone makers can't get it right.
If these were all $25 novelties, I would cut them some slack, but for the price they're charging, I'd rather get a Dingoo or something.

[Satoshi_Matrix]

Alright guys, reply time!

Hey there. Have you tried using headphones? Does this make the wavy lines go away?

When I say wavy sych-loss lines, I'm talking about horizontal lines that go through the entire length of the screen, not just on the edges. They only occur in certain games (Super Mario World, Yoshi's Island, and Super Gameboy confirmed so far). Putting in headphones does absolutely nothing.

And can you explain what exactly you're doing in shmups with the d-pad? I had a youtube user email me about the Pokefami DX and specifically tested diagonals with R-Type III and Gradius 3; I rolled around in several directions and things seemed great to me.

I'm just simply playing it and finding that the dpad just doesn't respond when you roll and shoot. The Supaboy has this issue too, but with the supaboy the controls just simply lock up and refuse to do anything. - on the RDP, they reverse! So for instance, if your flying down right and the controls lock up, you start flying up and to the left even while you hold down the dpad in the complete other direction. The only way to fix this is to let go of the dpad completely and resume. I've confirmed this occurs with Super R-Type, Axelay, UN Squardron and Gokujou Parodius so far. It likely effects ALL shooters, but I haven't been able to confirm this or not. You can just use an SNES controller or one of the two controllers the system comes with to get around this, but just like the Supaboy, this thing is suppose to be portable. Imagine if you couldn't use the dpad on the PSP and instead had to use some sort of controller coming out the USB port or something. It's ridiculous.


That being said, I do really like the shape and form factor of the RDP. its FAR better than either the FC-16 GO or the Supaboy. The stand, the dongle thing to connect controllers, the way cartridges snap into place, it's got a lot of things going for it. Don't take my initial post to reflect my final verdict. I was just giving a breif initial impressions overview of the problems since I had high hopes that this would somehow be problem-free.

They are great. Well, one of mine is great. The other doesn't register down-right diagonals. I'll open it up to check the problem. Other than that, they are great controllers. They feel good in my hands and are very responsive. Almost as good as using original SNES controllers.

Hm. Both of mine work perfectly. They use the same size and style dpad as a real SNES and I think they're comfortable and the shoulder buttons feel really nice. I hope you can get the other controller working. While you have it apart, please take us some pics. I would take mine apart, but since you said that you're going to do that anyway....

I do hear a buzz, and a high-pitched sound, but I don't know if it was worse with the Supaboy as I didn't try it. What I don't like is that the buzz and high-pitched sound are still present when I listen through headphones. As for the screen, I don't see any wavy lines, it's all good.

Try playing Super Mario World, Yoshi's Island or the SuperGameBoy. All three will have very visible problems.

I tried Gradius I & III, and Zelda ALttP. Moving diagonaly is not always easy, and it will sometimes move in the opposite direction like you said. I don't really like the Dpad, and the ABXY buttons are too far from each other. I will mostly play with the controllers !

I'm somewhat morbidly glad to hear that someone else has experienced the same freaky reversal of controls that I have. It's so weird - I am completely at loss to think of any way to explain that. I love the feel of the RDP's built in dpad and the buttons are alright as well, but I wholeheartedly agree that the ABXY buttons are too far apart. Its much more difficult to reach from the Y button to the A button than it should be.

From all the games I tested, only two didn't work : Kirby Super Star and Super Mario RPG (obviously). I thought the first release of Mario RPG worked on clones ? I do think I have a first release.

I'm glad you mentioned that because I forgot to! My made-in-mexico Mario RPG 1.1 WORKS with the RDP! It does NOT work on the SupaBoy, FC-16 GO or the standalone RetroDuo. This, coupled with the fact that the screen doesn't have sych issues, makes me very pleased with the RDP and is a big step in the right direction.

Also, the sound when playing NES games is very bad. There's a lot of "grainy" noise.

For me, this is by far the most disappointing aspect, though I'm hopeful some tech-head amongst us can weasel out a solution. the standalone RetroDuo has a similar audio defect with the NES side, and this can be cleaned up by adding in a simple audio dampener. I'm hoping something similar can be rigged for the RDP. As I said before, the NOAC is in the cartridge adapter.

the Supaboy that I got from Hyperkin as a RMA replacement for my first unit (which was part of the prototype batch) does NOT have any buzzing at all, and honestly, that makes a world of difference for me.

Wow man thats pretty cool. How does it feel to be the ONLY PERSON to have a Supaboy without audio issues?

Well, none of this sounds very appealing to me. Maybe I'll just stick to the FC 16 Go.

As much as I want to, I honestly can't really argue against that. Despite its crazy short battery life and crappy screen, the FC-16 GO has the best sound, the best video output to a tv, awesome wireless controllers and is also the cheapest of the three (four if you count the PokeFami DX)

It's a real shame that all these clone makers can't get it right.
If these were all $25 novelties, I would cut them some slack, but for the price they're charging, I'd rather get a Dingoo or something.

There's no way this would ever happen. the profit margin for these devices is likely extremely low. I seriously doubt Yobo, Hyperkin or RetroBit are making that much money selling these. I'm not trying to defend the companies or anything, but I'm just saying that you are being completely unrealistic if you expect reverse engineered hardware clones to ever be cheap, especially handheld ones.

[TonyTheTiger]

There's no way this would ever happen. the profit margin for these devices is likely extremely low. I seriously doubt Yobo, Hyperkin or RetroBit are making that much money selling these. I'm not trying to defend the companies or anything, but I'm just saying that you are being completely unrealistic if you expect reverse engineered hardware clones to ever be cheap, especially handheld ones.

What he's saying is that had these been cheapy novelties then the problems wouldn't be much of an issue but for the price they're actually charging people should be able to expect the hardware to be mostly problem-free. Incompatibility issues with some games aren't even the real problem. But when they're charging nearly $100 for something, there's no excuse for consistent audio problems and reversing controls. I don't mind paying $100 for an SNES portable. But if I'm going to shell that out the thing better work right.

[kedawa]

What he's saying is that had these been cheapy novelties then the problems wouldn't be much of an issue but for the price they're actually charging people should be able to expect the hardware to be mostly problem-free. Incompatibility issues with some games aren't even the real problem. But when they're charging nearly $100 for something, there's no excuse for consistent audio problems and reversing controls. I don't mind paying $100 for an SNES portable. But if I'm going to shell that out the thing better work right.

Exactly.
The problems present in these clones are inexcusable for a finished product at that price point.

[Satoshi_Matrix]

So, I take it that the RDP uses actual SNES controller inputs, or does it use proprietary controllers that you opened and did wire traces to the button maps?

Uhhh what? the RDP uses a bridge connector that allows you to use any 7-pin SNES controller with it. The Controllers it comes with are standard 7-pin SNES style controllers that work with anything that has a SNES connection.

Actually, I see that the unit has a mini USB controller adapter.

Not quite. Its a proprietary connector slightly different from USB. It allows you to use any two 7-pin SNES controllers.

So, does this effect using REAL SNES pads on SNES games, or just real SNES pads on NES games where the Y doesn't function?

No; NES B and A being mapped the SNES B and A only affects the NES adapter. In SNES mode, all of the standart SNES buttons are mapped correctly. This is only an NES issue.

I tried Super Mario World and Yoshi's Island, and the screen was perfect. I wonder why your RDP has a problem with that.

I've since discovered you have to really force your cartridges into position before hitting the power switch. I find it helps to physically hold the game cartridge in place when I power it on to ensure the wavy line issues don't occur. I'll explain what I mean when I do a video review this weekend.

Exactly.
The problems present in these clones are inexcusable for a finished product at that price point.

This is just the nature of clones from China. The parts supplies DO NOT CARE. Yelling at Hyperkin/Retrobit/Yobo or whatever is somewhat of a wasted effort. You really should be yelling at Shenzhen Qi Sheng Long as they're the ones who actually produce 90% of all these clones.

[Akito01]

You must defeat Shenzhen Qi Sheng Long to stand a chance!

[Old_Skool_Fool]

You must defeat Shenzhen Qi Sheng Long to stand a chance!

Hahaha, that's great!

Hey everyone, it's been awhile and been pretty busy and last I tried stopping by, it seemed DP was down due to some intergalactic net criminals..lol



Anyways, just wanted everyone to know about the newest Super UFO 8 Pro device out now here (Compatible with the RDP), and honestly wanted somebody's help regarding the in-depth compatibility/review (This thing seems pretty badass!) And will work with the RDP!.


I think Satoshi did a bang up job on the in-depth RDP review, so if you PM me and I'll hit you back with some delicious details, and and awesome kickback for it.


Also in the meantime, I just wanted everyone to know about the new Free Giveaways Das Cheap that are open to everyone (no purchase necessary) and can find out the details above!

[Leo_A]

It's still ultimately their fault. If they can't get decent suppliers, they shouldn't be doing this in the first place. It's no excuse.

[MarioMania]

Looks like if I have the Money, I'll get the Supaboy with the RetroGen Adapter..

I'm just waiting for Satoshi_Matrix review this weekend

[TonyTheTiger]

It's still ultimately their fault. If they can't get decent suppliers, they shouldn't be doing this in the first place. It's no excuse.

Or at least be more up front about it. I mean, I get it. Clones have problems. Anybody that adamant about perfection should use original hardware. Fair enough. But I've read a bunch of old threads and it seems like a game. Some new clone comes out, the sellers paint it as superior to the competition, they're light on the actual details until release, the potential buyers get excited, then people actually get the thing and notice problems. Is there really ANY reason why people weren't allowed to know about the controller actually reversing itself until after they bought the thing?

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

Wow man thats pretty cool. How does it feel to be the ONLY PERSON to have a Supaboy without audio issues?

Well, the only one in the DP community perhaps, but surely not the only PERSON.

As Tofu stated, they identified and corrected the buzzing issue in production and the batch after the initial run has that corrected. There's probably tons of them in the wild without that issue.

Any post-prototype batch that still buzz was likely based on some mix-up during manufacturing where they used old parts or packed/shipped prototype stock.

Based on reports in these threads that those who sent their units in immediately got buzzers back I waited a good couple of months after the issue was rectified to send my unit in for replacement.

When I did make a move to get my unit replaced, I didn't have any major issues with contacting their customer service department .... so I guess I feel fortunate that I didn't run into any trouble.

Based on reports of high-pitched squealing with the RDP I'm going to similarly wait for a V2 with these as well.

[Satoshi_Matrix]

there is really no buzzing issue with SNES games on the RDP.It sounds pretty much exactly like the FC-16 GO. The issue is in the NES games. I can't put my finger on it exactly - its like there is audio distortion in the square waves. Perhaps this can be corrected, I don't know. It is very disappointing that the NOAC isn't the same one used for the RetroDuo standalone since Castlevania III doesn't work. I can successfully get Akumajou Densetsu to boot without major graphical errors, but the square waves are heavily distorted, and none of the expansion channels the VRC6 provides come through at all.

Oh and while I'm talking about the NES adapter, it does the weirdest thing! For WHATEVER REASON, RetroBit mapped the NES B and A buttons to the SNES B and A buttons!! You might think this makes sense, but no! When Nintendo designed the Super Famicom controller, they deliberately mapped SNES Y to NES B and SNES B to NES A. This was done because early in development, the Super Famicom was originally going to be backwards compatible with the Famicom. Even after the Famicom support was dropped, Nintendo still stuck to the Y and B structure for the vast majority of games starting with Super Mario World.

This choice on Nintendo's part worked out great for clones like the RetroDuo which use SNES controllers to play NES games. On the RD, you just plug in a real SNES controller and away you go, using Y and B.

So yeah, it is extremely odd that RetroBit would have gone out of their way to override that and remap the inputs to B and A on the SNES pad. This makes NES controllers modded to work on the SNES or RetroDuo useless on the RDP since NES B corrisponds to SNES Y, and this adapter leaves Y unmapped.

[Frankie_Says_Relax]

there is really no buzzing issue with SNES games on the RDP.It sounds pretty much exactly like the FC-16 GO. The issue is in the NES games. I can't put my finger on it exactly - its like there is audio distortion in the square waves. Perhaps this can be corrected, I don't know. It is very disappointing that the NOAC isn't the same one used for the RetroDuo standalone since Castlevania III doesn't work. I can successfully get Akumajou Densetsu to boot without major graphical errors, but the square waves are heavily distorted, and none of the expansion channels the VRC6 provides come through at all.

Oh and while I'm talking about the NES adapter, it does the weirdest thing! For WHATEVER REASON, RetroBit mapped the NES B and A buttons to the SNES B and A buttons!! You might think this makes sense, but no! When Nintendo designed the Super Famicom controller, they deliberately mapped SNES Y to NES B and SNES B to NES A. This was done because early in development, the Super Famicom was originally going to be backwards compatible with the Famicom. Even after the Famicom support was dropped, Nintendo still stuck to the Y and B structure for the vast majority of games starting with Super Mario World.

This choice on Nintendo's part worked out great for clones like the RetroDuo which use SNES controllers to play NES games. On the RD, you just plug in a real SNES controller and away you go, using Y and B.

So yeah, it is extremely odd that RetroBit would have gone out of their way to override that and remap the inputs to B and A on the SNES pad. This makes NES controllers modded to work on the SNES or RetroDuo useless on the RDP since NES B corrisponds to SNES Y, and this adapter leaves Y unmapped.

So, I take it that the RDP uses actual SNES controller inputs, or does it use proprietary controllers that you opened and did wire traces to the button maps?

Actually, I see that the unit has a mini USB controller adapter.

So, does this effect using REAL SNES pads on SNES games, or just real SNES pads on NES games where the Y doesn't function?

[Choses]

Try playing Super Mario World, Yoshi's Island or the SuperGameBoy. All three will have very visible problems.

I tried Super Mario World and Yoshi's Island, and the screen was perfect. I wonder why your RDP has a problem with that.

[Culex4096]

I got my RDP today, turned it on and almost immediately boxed it back up. A lit green pixel was dead center and so I decided to return it and get a new one. I played around with it briefly and was impressed by SNES compatibility. Also, the controller attachment is very very tight. And like Satoshi Matrix has been saying though, the NES sound is weird. Not bad, but weird. However, the one thing I noticed is that my screen was not as crisp as my Supaboy screen..... and yes I removed the plastic screen protector XD. Overall, I'm waiting for a new one now I suppose.

Oh, and Genesis games seem to play pretty well too with the Retrogen. Not great because it is a rather cheap GOAC, but the adapter works just as well as it does on my SNES.

[csgx1]

I'm just simply playing it and finding that the dpad just doesn't respond when you roll and shoot. The Supaboy has this issue too, but with the supaboy the controls just simply lock up and refuse to do anything. - on the RDP, they reverse! So for instance, if your flying down right and the controls lock up, you start flying up and to the left even while you hold down the dpad in the complete other direction. The only way to fix this is to let go of the dpad completely and resume. I've confirmed this occurs with Super R-Type, Axelay, UN Squardron and Gokujou Parodius so far. It likely effects ALL shooters, but I haven't been able to confirm this or not. You can just use an SNES controller or one of the two controllers the system comes with to get around this, but just like the Supaboy, this thing is suppose to be portable. Imagine if you couldn't use the dpad on the PSP and instead had to use some sort of controller coming out the USB port or something. It's ridiculous.

The dpad problem sounds like a major issue and possibly a deal breaker for me since I usually only focus on shooters and fighting games. I saw your excellent review on the Supaboy which was the main reason why I held off on the Supaboy. I would imagine that there are issues with the Street Fighter controls on the RDP as well? Do certain moves or combos lock up or can't easily be performed? Maybe you could possibly elaborate more on the Street Fighter control problem if you have the time.

I'm really looking forward to your RDP review.

[Satoshi_Matrix]

You must defeat Shenzhen Qi Sheng Long to stand a chance!

lol truer words have never been spoken.

Looks like if I have the Money, I'll get the Supaboy with the RetroGen Adapter..

I'm just waiting for Satoshi_Matrix review this weekend

Yeah, I love Satoshi Matrix's reviews...... hopefully he'll do a video review like he did with the Supaboy *wink* *wink*

Thanks for your support guys! I actually want to make this my 500th Subscriber Special - As of this post, I'm currently setting at 492 subscribers. I'd like to actually make that number 500 before posting the full video review filled with many things I've only scratched the surface on here.

So as much as I hate shameless self promition.....time for some shameless self premotion! If you guys haven't yet, please subscribe to my channel. I post tech reviews all the time showing off unusual controllers, adapters and hardware. If you want the scoop on weird imported Japanese controllers or want more info on a particular Famiclone, this is the place for you.

http://www.youtube.com/user/SatoshiMatrix1

Or at least be more up front about it. I mean, I get it. Clones have problems. Anybody that adamant about perfection should use original hardware. Fair enough. But I've read a bunch of old threads and it seems like a game. Some new clone comes out, the sellers paint it as superior to the competition, they're light on the actual details until release, the potential buyers get excited, then people actually get the thing and notice problems. Is there really ANY reason why people weren't allowed to know about the controller actually reversing itself until after they bought the thing?

As much as it sucks, it sort of makes sense from a marketing point of view. They make a product and want to hide its flaws to the consumer. Its up to consumer reports to reveal the truth. Think of really anything - videogames, movies, whatever. The developers come out with the game or film and they don't tell you what they produced is a pile of garbage even if that IS the case. It's up to reviewers to do that. I'm saying its right, but its not like clone makers are special or unique in any way. Just saying.

Also remember that my comments about the dpad only applies to the build-in dpad. The Supaboy has the same issues with its built in dpad but in its case the controls just freeze until you release the dpad. The RDP allows you to use the dongle and attach real controllers or the excellent included ones to play your games on the go. The sytem comes with a nice little stand that allows it to be set up on a table or desk or whatever and you can play with the controller. It might not be ideal for a portable device but its serviceable.

The dpad problem sounds like a major issue and possibly a deal breaker for me since I usually only focus on shooters and fighting games. I saw your excellent review on the Supaboy which was the main reason why I held off on the Supaboy. I would imagine that there are issues with the Street Fighter controls on the RDP as well? Do certain moves or combos lock up or can't easily be performed? Maybe you could possibly elaborate more on the Street Fighter control problem if you have the time.

I'm really looking forward to your RDP review.

Again keep in mind my comments about the dpad only are about the system's built-in dad. It does come with a controlelr adapter to use real SNES controllers as well as two of its own controllers which are absolutely fantastic. Not enough things can be said about the included controllers. But if you are concerned about Fighters, don't worry. Super Street Fighter II plays perfect on the RDP. The dpad is very quick and responsive. My problems with the dpad going haywire only seem to affect shumps. On the RDP controls I can fire off hidokens, cannon drills and shoryukens as easy as pie.

Thank you for your support! I'll have a review up as soon as I hit 500 subs. Only eight to go!


Big announcement!

With the help of Ace and my good friend Emiliano, I've discovered that you CAN get Castlevania III to work on the RDP! It involves wiring a NAND gate or a NOT gate (I used a NOT gate) across pins 65 and 58 invert the A13 output. All you need to do is wire a NAND or NOT gate between these two pins and then apply 5v and a source of ground. In my case, I stole 5v from pin 36 and ground from pin 72. Wired it all up and sure enough, completely playable CV3! The audio is still messed up for it and certain other games, so there still needs to be some sort of fix for that.

I should also mention that audio issues for NES games are NOT universal. Some NES games sound completely fine when you play them on the RDP through the build-in speakers. For example, Megaman 2, Megaman 3, Castlevania 1, Metroid, and even Action 52 all sound completely normal. Its only when you plug in headphones that nasty things start to occur with the audio.

Anyway that'll be it for now! Again, please keep an eye on my youtube channel as I'll have new stuff coming tomorrow.

While I think of it, one more question for Oldskoolfool if he's lurking -

What the heck happened to the announced NES retroport with AV output? I want to be able to use the NES thing on my SNES without the aid of the TriStar!

[TonyTheTiger]

As much as it sucks, it sort of makes sense from a marketing point of view. They make a product and want to hide its flaws to the consumer.

Of course I understand that. Except what happens is that you lose people's goodwill after a while. You keep it up and nobody is going to trust you when you're trying to sell your third or fourth product and everybody starts doing what Frankie said and wait for a fixed revision. So just do it right the first time and be done with it.

[MarioMania]

I tried Gradius I & III, and Zelda ALttP. Moving diagonaly is not always easy, and it will sometimes move in the opposite direction like you said. I don't really like the Dpad, and the ABXY buttons are too far from each other. I will mostly play with the controllers !

That really turns me off

How about games like Street Fighter 2 Turbo??

[nusilver]

You know, I think I am going to cancel my RDP pre-order. Honestly, the only reason I had it ordered to begin with was that I wanted to compare it to the Pokefami DX, and possibly swap out the screens because of my 1 stuck pixel...but I don't even notice it while I'm playing, so I guess, what's the point?

I've been sampling shmups all morning - Gradius III, R-Type 3, and Rendering Ranger. Zero problems with diagonals. Here's a short video demonstrating this. Note my 7-year-old nephew is recording for me and provides brief narration. (also my 9 year old nephew is playing Kingdom Hearts BBS, so that is why you're hearing "huh! ha! huh! ha!")

Satoshi_Matrix, I'll get the Sonic video recorded tomorrow when I'm not babysitting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHwq3jdC3Mc