What's the official Digital Press/CGE stance on this?

[Raccoon Lad]

Joe, since you're part owner of Commavid, what's your official stance on this? http://www.atariage.com/forums/viewt...d993813f61df40

[Tempest]

Actually I think it's only John and Sean who own the rights to Commavid now. I suppose they could make a fuss about it, but that would be pretty mean unless they were planning on selling the same thing. Then again do we really want to start throwing around copyright laws in the Classic Gaming community? That could lead to some pretty nasty stuff.

Tempest

[digitalpress]

Actually I think it's only John and Sean who own the rights to Commavid now. I suppose they could make a fuss about it, but that would be pretty mean unless they were planning on selling the same thing. Then again do we really want to start throwing around copyright laws in the Classic Gaming community? That could lead to some pretty nasty stuff.

Yes, I'm not part-owner, merely a beneficiary

I'm not sure this is such a big event, really. Didn't Ken Love at Activision order Atari Age to take down the Activision ROMS from their site because they had future plans to release them (Anthology)?

In what way would it be different for the CommaVid owners to do the same and/or stop any unauthorized profiteering of their product by others? Would this seem "meaner" or less mean?

[Sniderman]

There is no difference - none - except for "perspective." Here's as I see it:

Activision - a viable company still in business with the weight of a successful game company behind them - asks AA to stop with the ROMs for they're releasing a new Activision product that encompasses those ROMs. Reaction from the community? "OK Activision. We can see that you're large and powerful and have plans to use these ROMs in an upcoming project. No harm."

John and Sean - two hobbyist guys much like ourselves who happened to have bought the Commavid rights some time ago - asks another hobbyist to stop making Commavid carts because, well, they techinically own it. Reaction from the community? "You killjoys! You just want the money for yourself. Why are you guys being so hardassed about this? Are you planning on releasing something like this? No? Then screw off."

I'm not saying that it'd pan out this way. But we see it with every proto that comes down the pike and I see this being no different. If John and Sean were a business (JohnSean Inc.) with plans to mass produce these, then the community would dummy up.

Wow. It'll be interesting to see how this pans out.

[digitalpress]

The thing is, you don't know how much John and Sean invested in those rights. And they may want to someday reclaim the investment by releasing something just like this multi-cart thingy. So whether they're "big" or not, don't they still have a right to capitalize on an investment rather than see someone else beat them to it?

Another point: I get the "perspective", but what about the "scale"? Activision: BIG. Big money, big release, big audience. CommaVid: SMALL. Does being small give the owners any less of a right to see same-scale returns on their properties?

These are all hypothetical questions. I honestly don't know what the plan is!

[Griking]

The thing is, you don't know how much John and Sean invested in those rights. And they may want to someday reclaim the investment by releasing something just like this multi-cart thingy.

Do you feel this way because you happen to know John and Sean or do you or do you have the same respect for all other copyright owers as well? For instance how do you feel about emulation in general? Doesn't emulation steal potential profits from existing game companies like Nintendo, Sega, Activision, etc...

[Phosphor Dot Fossils]

In my own little weird twisted view of the universe...I would show even more respect for whatever new Commavid goodies Sean and John bring into the world than I would for a large corporate entity like Activision. Not because I know them or anything - because outside of these forums, honestly, I really don't - but because I can definitely appreciate the legwork they'll have to do to keep that venture above water. And they don't have investors, or any kind of safety cushion. (Then again, they're only catering to a niche audience which gathers into a buying frenzy a couple or three times in the average year, so they can be leisurely with their R&D and marketing costs too.)

The point is, they're not a corporate entity. They're a couple of us, just game collectors, trying to bring something new to us. If they wanted the ROMs for this stuff gone because they had the intention of re-releasing it, as Actvision did, I wouldn't have a beef with that. And if such a request does come down the pike? I suggest we all sit tight and comply with it, because I for one find the idea of a company existing solely to turn out brand new games for classic consoles very appealing.

Not sure if I've said anything here or not. All I want to know is, will that cool Commavid artwork style still be on everything?

[udisi]

From the looks of this, this is nothing new...the company released both magicard, and videolife seperatly before. Judging that Sean and John are I assume big atari people, and most likely frequent atari age, I then assume they know about this. If there were a problem I think we would have heard about it when this company released these games seperatly.... I could be wrong, but I have a feeling they know about this.

[Captain Wrong]

I agree with Earl 100%. With this being such a specalized market we're talking here, anyone doing something like this is going to take a big chunk out of potential sales assuming John and Sean want to do something like this. I know if I was in a position to make carts, I wouldn't feel comfortable doing Commavid without those guys blessings. Maybe the maker of this cart has them. Who knows?

[digitalpress]

The thing is, you don't know how much John and Sean invested in those rights. And they may want to someday reclaim the investment by releasing something just like this multi-cart thingy.

Do you feel this way because you happen to know John and Sean or do you or do you have the same respect for all other copyright owers as well? For instance how do you feel about emulation in general? Doesn't emulation steal potential profits from existing game companies like Nintendo, Sega, Activision, etc...

It's not a subjective view at all. If anyone has plans to use the properties - or even *potentially* plans to, then I'll comply. I've always been in support of game developers AND the hobby, surely you wouldn't question that... I was once asked by the Intellivision folks at one time to take down the ROMS I have online (just before Intellivision Lives came out) - but they ultimately reversed their decision. I had no problem with it either way. What I do makes no money so I have nothing to gain or lose.

[CX2K]

Hi,

Let me try to explain our position regarding the CommaVid rights...

Sean and I purchased the CommaVid rights with the intention of re-releasing Magicard and Video Life to the gaming public. Our plans were/are to release them in authentic style boxes with manuals, although they would be in regular style cart cases (not the elongated CommaVid cart style).

We also plan to open up CommaVid.com with as much information and history about the company and it's games as possible. We did not buy the rights so that we could shut down sites conatining those roms. Our intent is to have the roms remain available for all to enjoy. We did toy with the idea of asking sites to remove just Magicard and Video Life since we are planning on selling them at some point but we figured there wouldn't be any point to it since anyone who wants a nice boxed version would buy it regardless if the rom was available or not.

In regards to the reproductions being sold by Sunmark, we contacted the person responsible for them and asked him to stop. He claimed that he had done a copyright search and that his attorney couldn't find any copyright on file for these games and therefore he claimed he has a right to do what he wants with them.

I contacted the copyright office and was informed that this is not true. Any published work has an implied copyright dating back to the date it was published. In order to pursue any legal action, we first have to file a copyright application with the copyright office (which we are currently doing for all the games), then once the application is accepted for review, we can pursue legal action. The problem we have is that obviously, Sean and I are just 2 fellow collectors who don't have a legal team or the money to retain a copyright lawyer. It would be nice to be Activision size in the legal dept.

The owner of Sunmark is obviously aware that we don't have the means to defend ourselves and has chosen to disregard our copyright. His latest 'multi-cart' is an even bigger way of saying "Fuck You!" to us. Unfortunately, it's not likely we'll be able to do anything about it. If anyone can refer us to a cheap copyright lawyer, please contact us.

In the meantime, we would ask that you not encourage this violation of our rights by purchasing these products. Please wait for our boxed versions.

As soon as we get the CGE2k3 announcement out of the way, we'll try to get going on the commavid site.

Hope this helps to clear things up. And please enjoy the games!

John & Sean

[Raedon]

Sean still trying to sell multi-carts for $120+?

[markdil]

I would like to respond to the above posts. I was contacted by John asking
me to stop making my first release of the Magicard and Video Life. I was
more than reasonable, in fact I agreed to stop making the games IMMEDIATELY
if they would buy my remaining inventory. They said "NO PROBLEM"!! John
informed me he would send me a check RIGHT after the CGE. The CGE came and
went and no check. I called and emailed and did not get the courtesy of a
single solitary response. What's with that?? I know, the check is in the
mail!!

I think this is a case of the pot calling the kettle black!! How many
Multicarts have they sold?? If that isn't a blatant perpetration of
copyright infringement, NOTHING IS!!

If you guys want to honor the deal you reneged on, you know how to contact
me!!

Mark DiLuciano

[Wavelflack]

Hmm..why should they buy the carts you manufactured when they own the copyright?

Nintendo: "Please stop pirating our games!"
Hong Kong: "Okay! You buy out our inventory of pirate copies of your games, and then we'll stop selling them!"
Nintendo: "That sounds great!"

[markdil]

Hmm..why should they buy the carts you manufactured when they own the copyright?

I think you are missing something here!! NO COPYRIGHTS WERE
FILED!! They can't own something that does not EXIST!!

Not to mention, you can't buy an IMPLIED copyright!!

[Wavelflack]

Then what did they purchase?

Beyond that point, if you indeed believe that no copyright or mark exists (or at least not in their hands), then why would you agree to cease manufacturing and selling of your repros?

Hmm...

[markdil]

Then what did they purchase?

Beyond that point, if you indeed believe that no copyright or mark exists (or at least not in their hands), then why would you agree to cease manufacturing and selling of your repros?

Hmm...

I am not sure what they purchased!! But, six months before they
bought ANYTHING, I was making these games. I spent $500 to
have it researched because I did not want to infringe on ANYONE!
With that being said, I started production. I agreed to stop because
I am reasonable. John offered to buy the inventory if I stopped!
I agreed!! And how in the name of GOD can they throw copyright
law at ME, when the infringe on HUNDREDS of VALID copyrights??
Look at this:

http://home.xnet.com/~skelly/multis.htm

Did they write these programs?? Do they have the right to copy
them? Do you think Atari didn't file copyrights on them?? How
about Activision??? This is a case of "Do as I say, not as I do"!!
I am livid that they can make a deal with me, I complied and they
didn't!

[jjessop]

Hmm..why should they buy the carts you manufactured when they own the copyright?

I think you are missing something here!! NO COPYRIGHTS WERE
FILED!! They can't own something that does not EXIST!!

Not to mention, you can't buy an IMPLIED copyright!!

Your absolutely wrong on this. Copywrites do exist even if not applied for. I'm sure if you look in any of the Commavid manuals and maybe some game screens, you will find a copywrite notice but that's not even required.

As for Sean's multi-carts, I would love to defend it........but I can't. If YOU owned the copywrites you could get them stopped. In this particular case your on the wrong side of the legal argument.

jerry

[markdil]

Your absolutely wrong on this. Copywrites do exist even if not applied for. I'm sure if you look in any of the Commavid manuals and maybe some game screens, you will find a copywrite notice but that's not even required.

As for Sean's multi-carts, I would love to defend it........but I can't. If YOU owned the copywrites you could get them stopped. In this particular case your on the wrong side of the legal argument.

jerry

First, copyright is spelled C-O-P-Y-R-I-G-H-T
Second, I had a copyright, trademark and patent law firm with over
200 lawyers tell me that it was not infringing on ANYTHING!! Sorry,
I believe them, not you.

THIRD, I want to know why they reneged on their DEAL???? John,
why didn't you return my calls?? Why didn't you respond to email??
If you changed your mind, why didn't you tell me??? I know you
are reading this, WHY DON'T you answer the QUESTION??????

[markdil]

You know what's funny, I have since received six
anonymous emails from different people letting me
know some of the other shenanigans you guys partake
in! Here are a few:

Is it true you sell Coleco Multicarts "under the table"
and were told by Telegames not to sell them???
Is that true JOHN??

How about this, are you making these games without the
rights: Elevator Action, Save the Whales, Crack'ed and
Pick-Up?? Are you??

Did you guys get upset over some ROM's being released
that you didn't have the rights to?? I thought you were
so into helping the gaming community!! Why would you
get upset??

Can you answer a few of those questions for me??
Thank you so much...