Some questions on the history of 2-D fighting games...

[Proclus]

Hi!

I’m currently working on an article about 2-D fighting games from titles like Karate Champ (1984) up to 1995. I’m only concerned with one-on-one games (or 2-on-2, 3-on-3, etc., SNK-style), so this excludes the whole beat-em-up genre (Double Dragon, Final Fight, etc.). I have four questions for gamers who are familiar with the fighting game genre. If you only want to answer one or two of them, feel free to do so – any info will be appreciated!

1) HIDDEN MOVES. The revolutionary Street Fighter II (1991) clearly marked the beginning of a new era for fighting games – among other things, button-mashing was no longer sufficient, with the importance awarded to special moves and an intricate combo system. Was the original Street Fighter (1987) the truly first fighting game featuring "hidden moves" (that’s how they were called at the time) performed with a specific joystick motion and button tapping?

2) WEAPONS. Was Samurai Showdown (1993) the first fighting game awarding a key role to a character’s weapon? Are weapons important in other 1993-1995 fighting game series by SNK (I'm not as familiar with them as I should be)? WeaponLord (1995) would make weapons even more crucial (with thrust blocking and many other techniques) a few years later...

3) FATALITIES. The Mortal Kombat series obviously influenced a slew of fighting games. Which pre-1996 fighting games other than MK I-II-III incorporated fatalities/finishing moves in their gameplay? I’m thinking of TimeKillers, Eternal Champions, BloodStorm, Killer Instinct, Primal Rage and WeaponLord; are there others? Do some pre-1996 SNK fighting games have fatalities also?

4) COMBOS REGISTERED ON SCREEN. Combos became more and more important in post-SF II fighting games. Was Super Street Fighter II (1993) the very first game which the combos were registered on screen (i.e. with 4-hit combo flashing briefly)? Which other pre-1996 fighting games also had this feature? I know about Primal Rage, most of Capcom’s titles (X-Men: Children of the Atom, Darkstalkers, etc.), Killer Instinct, Mortal Kombat III, WeaponLord...

Thanks in advance!

[thehistorian]

I’m currently working on an article about 2-D fighting games from titles like Karate Champ (1984) up to 1995. I’m only concerned with one-on-one games, so this excludes the whole beat-em-up genre (Double Dragon, Final Fight, etc.). I have four questions for gamers who are familiar with the fighting game genre. If you only want to answer one or two of them, feel free to do so – any info will be appreciated!

1) HIDDEN MOVES. The revolutionary Street Fighter II (1991) clearly marked the beginning of a new era for fighting games – among other things, button-mashing was no longer sufficient, with the importance awarded to special moves and an intricate combo system. Was the original Street Fighter (1987) the truly first fighting game featuring "hidden moves" (that’s how they were called at the time) performed with a specific joystick motion and button tapping?

Yie Ar Kung-Fu 1985
The mechanics are more like Karate Champ..

2) WEAPONS. Was Samurai Showdown (1993) the first fighting game awarding a key role to a character’s weapon? Are weapons important in other 1993-1995 fighting game series by SNK (I'm not as familiar with them as I should be)? WeaponLord (1995) would make weapons even more crucial (with thrust blocking and many other techniques) a few years later...

What about Time Killers 1992 which you mention below..

3) FATALITIES. The Mortal Kombat series obviously influenced a slew of fighting games. Which pre-1996 fighting games other than MK I-II-III incorporated fatalities/finishing moves in their gameplay? I’m thinking of TimeKillers, Eternal Champions, BloodStorm, Killer Instinct, Primal Rage and WeaponLord; are there others? Do some pre-1996 SNK fighting games have fatalities also?

In the Art of fighting (1992) there was a special move that could only be done when you were low on life that was prettty devastating to your opponent. If they had any kind of damage it would more than likely finish off the other player. They held a contest to see if anyone could figure it out on thier own.

4) COMBOS REGISTERED ON SCREEN. Combos became more and more important in post-SF II fighting games. Was Super Street Fighter II (1993) the very first game which the combos were registered on screen (i.e. with 4-hit combo flashing briefly)? Which other pre-1996 fighting games also had this feature? I know about Primal Rage, most of Capcom’s titles (X-Men: Children of the Atom, Darkstalkers, etc.), Killer Instinct, Mortal Kombat III, WeaponLord...Thanks in advance!

Fighting Vipers 1995

[Proclus]

Thanks a lot for your mention of Time Killers as a pioneer for weapon-based fighting games, and of Yie Ar Kung-Fu re: the history of special moves in such games -- I was not very familiar with these.

In Art of fighting (1992) there was a special move that could only be done when you were low on life that was prettty devastating to your opponent. If they had any kind of damage it would more than likely finish off the other player. They held a contest to see if anyone could figure it out on thier own.

Very interesting info! This seems very close to what Namco would do in WeaponLord three years later -- i.e. not an isolated finishing move as in the MK games, but one that is integrated into the battle itself...

[Ed Oscuro]

I'd say Finishers/Finishing Moves, not Fatalities. "Fatality!" was just Midway's way of seperating themselves from other games that had finishing moves - not many at all, but the name change helped make the game seem yet more unique.

[Proclus]

I'd say Finishers/Finishing Moves, not Fatalities. "Fatality!" was just Midway's way of seperating themselves from other games that had finishing moves - not many at all, but the name change helped make the game seem yet more unique.

You're right.

I'd love to know which fighting games had finishing moves before the MK titles...

[Djfinny]

2.) WEAPONS - The first that I could remember playing when I was a little kid was Warrior - a 2 player top down vector graphics sword fighting game. It was made in 1979, this may be the first sword fighting game ever made. I found a link to it in klov.com

http://www.klov.com/game_detail.php?...&game_id=10408

Hope it helps in your research.

DJ

[chrisbid]

what about activision boxing?

[Proclus]

2.) WEAPONS - The first that I could remember playing when I was a little kid was Warrior - a 2 player top down vector graphics sword fighting game. It was made in 1979, this may be the first sword fighting game ever made.

Hope it helps in your research.

DJ

Thanks for mentioning Warrior, DJ -- it is widely considered to be the first 2-player fighting game; and while it does not have the "martial arts tournament" scheme that most fighting games would later have starting with Karate Champ (1984), you're right about its status as a pioneer re: weapon-based combat.

Thanks again!

[max 330 mega]

as far as finishing moves go, I would say samurai shodown had somewhat of finishing moves, be it when you finished the opponent with certain moves you may chop them in half, or slit there throat and blood would fly. would that count?

[Ed Oscuro]

what about activision boxing?

Boxing, from Atari, from 1978, right? Definitely worth a look.

Hmm...as for Finishers, for whatever reason all I can think of is Tongue of the Fatman/Mondo's Fight Palace LOL

For damage shown, Gladiator/Ohgon no Siro/Golden Castle from 1986 seems to have been an original title.

On the "realistic" graphics side, Sega's Holosseum and Mitchell's The Karate Tournament are both from 1992 - same as MK (if you ask me The Karate Tournament is the better of the two, simply because it doesn't snap your fighter into place and looks decent enough).

I'd say that a few unreleased fighters (Vicious Circle, Tattoo Assassins) are worth a mention as well :)

[Proclus]

what about activision boxing?

On the "realistic" graphics side, Sega's Holosseum and Mitchell's The Karate Tournament are both from 1992 - same as MK

Yes; there's also Midway's Pit Fighter, which was released in 1990 (it doesn't have a great reputation...).

[Ed Oscuro]

I hear about Pit Fighter all the time - haven't played it yet. Oh boy. I thought it would've been the usual cartoony stuff, after the console versions.