Is there a flash cart for the Atari Jaguar ?
There are some games I'd love to play on Jaguar, but you're right, Jag collecting is not for the faint of heart. It can get pretty damn expensive.
Is there a flash cart for the Atari Jaguar ?
There are some games I'd love to play on Jaguar, but you're right, Jag collecting is not for the faint of heart. It can get pretty damn expensive.
Last edited by WCP; 03-25-2014 at 10:30 PM.
What specific games are you talking about? Are you talking about homebrews that got a second run or reproductions of games released at retail? If it's the latter, the reproductions are worth significantly less than the original.Originally Posted by jgray3493
A good percentage of the Jaguar community would have a conniption if there was. There are some that think it's 1995 still, that this is a commercially viable system, and that it's big business with a potential to grow exponentially in the future. So they view a flash cartridge as merely a piracy enabler that would hurt these efforts despite that being anything but the case for systems like the Colecovision and Atari 7800.
Instead, what little publishing of note that has happened over the better part of the past 20 years has been releasing unreleased commercial projects. Beyond the occasional modest homebrew effort (Several of which shine even though they're not major affairs), there's very little development activity here. Much of what they think they're protecting are little more than futile dreams or people like the guy that stole a classic arcade game and released it before going nuts that thought he was an actual development/publishing house and was owed by the community to follow all his dictates if he were to continue. Not the type of homebrew attitude that deserves to be supported when there are great guys like PacManPlus in the Atari community doing it for the love of it and the community that they enjoy being a member of.
And I suspect some are collectors that are terrified of a few cartridges in their collection being devalued. Despite being an owner of the big one that goes for the most money, I can't say as I'd be upset to see others find alternate means to experience this. I don't support pirating homebrews, but as a Jaguar fan, it's definitely not a reason to be against a reprogrammable flash multicart that has so many legitimately useful advantages for the gamer and collector. Just because it can be used for a distasteful purpose doesn't erase the advantages it would offer.
I can't imagine something like my Atari 7800 these days without my Cuttle Cart II. It has added so much to my enjoyment of the system. Hopefully they come around someday and view such a development as an asset instead of something to crusade against.
Maybe it could finally rise from the dead in classic gaming circles like the 7800 has for anyone that has paid attention to the goings on there with the homebrew scene. Instead, sometimes this community in the past (I don't much follow it now for years) acts like it's in a Cold War of its own that's out to destroy itself instead of trying to flourish.
Last edited by Leo_A; 03-25-2014 at 01:30 PM.
There is actually a Skunkboard USB/Flash cart available for the Jaguar that allows the use of both commercial games and homebrews. The compromise the developers of the Skunkboard made is that a homebrew developer can lock their games out of being useable on the Skunkboard if they so choose. There is also a pretty healthy homebrew scene on the Jaguar beyond just the unreleased commercial games. I suspect the limited size of the active user base for the Jaguar is more of a factor for programmers choosing other platforms for homebrew projects than the lack of availability of an easy flashcart solution. The Jaguar Cart and CD encryption was unlocked a number of years ago now and most owners hardcore enough to continue actively playing their Jaguars likely have the CD Drive as well and most of the more recent projects have been distributed on CD-Roms.
Last edited by Bojay1997; 03-25-2014 at 01:40 PM.
That really doesn't do much good for the average fan.
With the multitude of solutions for many other classic systems out there, I have the convenience of having my own collection on a single cartridge if I'm not in the mood for changing games, I can easily play freely released homebrew efforts, I can get into the testing stages for many a homebrew, I can check out prototypes, I can check out various modifications of commercially released software from back in the day, I can check out commercial efforts that long ago ceased to be sold or protected by the IP holder that are fair game by most classic gamer's standards, and in many cases, it adds functionality that the original hardware never had like 7800 cartridges integrating the never officially released high score saving support.
Easily acquired multicart solutions only seem to have encouraged other homebrew communities and their fans. But in the Jaguar community, it often instead is portrayed as the devil and as the final nail in the Jaguar's coffin at a time when homebrew development has really hit its stride for several classic systems despite easily acquired multicart solutions.
I can't speak for them, but I bet someone like Pac-Man Plus would only have good things to say all around about something like the Cuttle Cart II.
I did a poor job of phrasing that, I fear. There indeed is quality homebrew activity taking place in the Jaguar community.
But it's not nearly to the degree that some of the most vocal and opinionated folks would like to think it is. Some attitudes are like I said and they act like this is big business that needs to be protected and that a multicart would lead to its destruction. And oftentimes, what is made available is often unavailable to quite a few Jaguar fans even when freely released by its author. Homebrew cartridges are expensive all around and rarely produced and the CD player is expensive not to mention the media is easily pirated with hardware in all of our homes.
A Everdrive/Harmony/Powerpak/Cuttle Cart style solution for the Jaguar would be very welcomed I believe once it was de-stigmatized and would only help the homebrew community reach its full potential.
Hopefully someday...
Last edited by Leo_A; 03-25-2014 at 02:01 PM.
Meh...I think the comparison to classic console multi-carts is a poor one. The Jaguar is more comparable to the SNES or Sega Genesis and while there are flash multi-carts available for those systems with removable storage cards, they are pricey and frankly not that much different than the Skunkboard. I suspect there will eventually be a more inexpensive and widely available solution for the Jaguar, but I don't know how significantly the audience is going to grow as it's still a niche system that ended up not being all that much more powerful or impressive than other 16 bit systems of the day.
I tried the Jaguar for the first time at VGS 2012. Not bad. I certainly had a blast playing Tempest. Rayman was as good as the PSX version. The racing game I played on the CD system was ok. The controller is bulky but still I think it's better than the N64.
Genesis does what Nintendon't
The Everdrive, SD2SNES, and Super Powerpak are fine contemporary flashcarts. They're definitely not extremely limited in their capabilities and are extremely user friendly. And while the SD2SNES is pricey, the others are priced fairly competitively to most any modern reprogrammable flash multicart. A little bit more than something like a Harmony for the 2600, but the technical requirements they face are a good bit higher which naturally leads to them being more expensive to produce.
Definitely not the 16 bit equivalents of the Skunkboard that is little more than a development tool. Great for programmers and testers, but of limited utility for the Jaguar gamer although I'm sure a good many went to such individuals since several hundred were sold through multiple revisions.
Excellent emulation and excellent multicarts are two of several reasons why homebrew thrives so much more on several classic consoles than it does on the Jaguar. It's a great tool for developer, publisher, and the community itself. Yet in the Jaguar world, both have been commonly derided. Attitudes seem to be changing towards emulation in recent years though, so I hold out hope that someone with the skills and desire will produce a multicart solution for this system and not be scared away.
Last edited by Leo_A; 03-26-2014 at 05:05 AM.
Reproductions
Here's a few.....Worms, Total Carnage, Towers II, Iron Soldier II, Breakout 2000, Skyhammer, Protector SE, HyperForce, and Soccer Kid are some that just got put on eBay. The seller is a company that specializes in atari. The eBay ID is "myatari". Anyways check it out.
None of those are reproductions. The Songbird games have never ceased being available from Songbird except the original Protector that was superceded by the special edition and the Telegames releases that are produced today are as official as they always were and are just new production runs from Telegames. Several vendors get new stock of the Telegames releases in from time to time from them like My Atari and Songbird.
As far as I'm aware, other than perhaps a prototype or two that has been manufactured and released without official permission like I imagine has been the case for Phaze Zero to name one release, nothing out there for the Jaguar qualifys as a reproduction.
Last edited by Leo_A; 03-26-2014 at 10:03 AM.
Those are not technically reproductions, they are simply additional print runs by the original publisher. Having said that, I have heard that the more recent print runs of the Telegames carts are of poorer quality than the originals as far as box, sticker and manual quality and in the case of their Lynx games, even the physical cartridge. As such, I have seen people pay more for the earlier runs of Telegames Lynx and Jaguar games because they don't like the newer editions.
There really isn't any reason to get a Jaguar anymore. Back in the days, it had great versions of games like Raiden, NBA Jam, and Doom... but all those can be had just as well on other systems. Meanwhile, the marquee Jaguar titles like Tempest 2000, Iron Soldier and Rayman ended up getting ported to PSX and Saturn anyways... so no real point in those.
In the end, all you're really left with are some mediocre odd-duck games like Attack of the Mutant Penguins, Club Drive, and Trevor McFur. If you're a jaded collector looking for something, anything new and interesting, then sure (Hey, I own a CD-i for exactly this reason, so I ain't gonna judge). But if you're looking for a new world of fun games, then look elsewhere. The JagCD is an even worse choice.
Alien vs. Predator is one that most people talk about when they talk about the Jaguar, but the game has aged very poorly. It was awesome back in 1995, but these days you just notice all the design problems.
Personally, I love the controller. It's one of the most comfortable controllers I've used. To each his own, I suppose.The controller is awful
Sure, they could be, but the author didn't choose to make SNES or Genesis versions. I don't really get how the Jaguar has managed to cultivate such a loyal homebrew scene (or how the SNES has totally failed to do so), but there it is.All the homebrews coming out look like they could have been done on a SNES or Genesis.
Are you suggesting the homebrew games are a good reason to own a Jaguar though?
I'm pretty sure they just stripped down the number of voice samples. She'll appear just as often, but say the same thing over and over. At least with the 2MB version, you get some variety in your adulation.In the 1MB of Cybermorph is the green woman completely removed?
Seriously though, learn to fly. Do NOT fly at full speed... it's not that kind of game.
Mostly, they were just too lazy to learn the system. Instead of making a new game that plays to the Jaguar's strengths, they just ported existing Genesis/SNES/Atari ST games hoping for a quick payoff. In most cases, the Jaguar at least had better colour.
In the end, I suppose they made the right choice. Unfortunately, any money/time they invested into serious Jaguar development wouldn't have proven very profitable. Games like Skyhammer and Battlesphere really show what the Jaguar was capable of when programmed by a skilled team, but they were far too late to save the system.
Well, Vid Grid, Myst, Dragon's Lair, Space Ace couldn't have been done on cartridge. Highlander used a lot of video cutscenes (though it could have been done without them), same with Baldies. Primal Rage could have been done on cart, though they'd likely have had to remove a lot of animation to do it. Putting Blue Lightning on CD was completely pointless.I'm wondering also if the CD add-on was even necessary, if the games were even that big that they'd need to be in disc format.
I will say though, the CD music in Battlemorph is excellent.
Don't bother. Get the PSX versions instead, unless you find a great deal on them. Worms on Jaguar is crazy expensive, and has no added content. Raiden Project on PSX includes Raiden II. Missile Command is the only one you can't get anywhere else, but it's an amazingly short game.
--Zero
Neither Iron Soldier game is on the Playstation or Saturn. Playstation got a sequel titled Iron Soldier III ported from the Nuon, but not either Jaguar release.
From my collection of games bought to play, I count several that I'd consider very good that were exclusive. Nothing I'd consider a system seller, but thanks to excellent versions of several releases that did appear elsewhere, I think the console itself is a worthy addition.
The CD attachment is much more questionable. Between their age and their escalating price in recent years, I'd have a difficult time justifying ever recommending that to someone new to the system (Particularly if someone doesn't get Cybermorph since the sequel is widely considered the top release for the CD add-on).
Last edited by Leo_A; 03-28-2014 at 03:57 AM.
Pretty much have to agree with Ze ro about Jaguar not being worth buying nowadays. From the video that I watched that showed all the games that were released, I was only interested in the games he mentioned which got better versions released for other systems like the PS1 and Saturn.
everyone always complains about the controller but I find it really comfortable to hold and use. they honestly could have put from shoulder buttons on there and it would have been way better, specially for games like doom, wolf 3d, AvP
COMPLETED MY USA SMS SET!!!!
Iron Soldier III on PSX is basically the same game with better graphics and more features. You're not missing out on anything by skipping the original.
--Zero
wow, I had no idea that Iron Soldier came out on any other system. I'm not a huge fan of the Jag version (it's ok, but don't think it aged very well) but I'll have to check out this PS1 version sometime.
I read that the Nuon version of IS3 is much superior to the PSX version however it is not compatible with all Nuon players. They planned to offer a fixed version but it was too late.
Do any of you know if Cybermorph (either version) allows you to control the volume of the green woman? If not, I may pick up a Jag/CD just for Battlemorph unless you guys can recommend a title on another system that is just about the same as this.
I've always loved the Jaguar, I picked it up in late 1993 (Dallas was one of the test markets so I got mine before the nationwide launch date, giving me an extra long wait for new games to trickle out) and I have pretty much all the games I really want for the system, other than maybe Battlesphere and a few others of the post-death releases like Skyhammer. And whenever somebody mentions the Jaguar, they always complain about the controller. And yet, I happen to like it, especially the Pro-Controller. I wonder, if it could have been redesigned before release to look visually smaller, if people would have not crapped their pants about it so much. Most people ramble about how large it is, but it's the perfect size for my hands. A third-party company should have put out an alternative back in the day, a company like Logitech (formed by former Atari employees if I recall).
Most of the people who complain about the Jaguar's controller have never actually used it.
So it's big? Check out this picture, and you can see it's not even much bigger than a Dreamcast controller, and I don't recall anyone complaining about that. It's certainly not heavy either.
So it's got a keypad? Big deal. Games didn't have to use it, and many didn't. Those that did generally came with overlays so you knew what button was what. Wasn't confusing in the slightest. I found it quite helpful for switching weapons and stuff. Frankly, I find shoulder buttons a stranger idea than a keypad.
--Zero
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote